Tangled web, where to start?

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  • #23005
    Avataroz
    PSTEC User

    Thanks, oz, but I respectfully disagree!
    There is a DIRECT correlation between the amount of jaw/tongue, etc., tension I am feeling, and my ability to “get plenty”.

    I'm not sure you do disagree with me. Again your post lacks clarity. What exactly do you mean by “get plenty” and what do you mean by your ability to “get plenty”? The tension is the PTSD issue and the 'plenty' is a financial issue, they are two seperate issues(even if they are linked and have overlap).

    Is this just a psychological issue or are there real world practical effects too? The way I see it either you want to maintain your financial situation or you want to improve it.

    Say you are in employment, if you want to maintain it the practical issue would be that the tension is hindering your ability to do your job properly and putting it at risk and that would also lead to worry. Otherwise, the psychological issue would be that you feel uncertainty and are worried(as many people are in a recession).

    If you wanted to improve your financial situation then the practical issue would be that the tension is hindering your ability to jobhunt. Otherwise the psychological issues would be either of needs(I can't pay my bills I'm worried, I can't pay my mortgage I might lose my home I'm really worried) or of luxuries(I like this nice jacket but I can't afford it that upsets me or I can't afford to travel and that upsets me).

    #23006
    AvatarPeter Bunyan
    PSTEC User

    Hi DG and Oz
    First DG
    Re Money worries, it's not the money it is the fear of loss of property, home, security and social status. Fear of family break-up and fear for the future. You can focus right down to putting some bills in front of you and feeling the “OMG where am I going to find the money to pay these” feelings and CT those. but I suspect this will bring on the PTSD or you can take a more defocused approach and CT on those more general fears I have just mentioned as long as this also does not make the PTSD worse.. Getting clear of some of this  background should enable some progress.
    Are you afraid of the PTSD symptoms themselves? A fear that they will come back? This is like an insomniac not getting to sleep because they are worrying about not getting to sleep. If this is so then this is another area to work on
    You said you got worse after using PSTEC Positive, without knowing what sentences you have been working with, it sounds like they have been too close to the cause. I suggest that you work with improving your confidence in the process itself that is a “positive” something on the lines of “PSTEC tools can help me get better” progressing to “PSTEC tools will get me better” to “PSTEC is making me better”. All while imagining yourself “better”.When you believe you will get better then you are on the road to recovery. Like the placebo effect I mentioned earlier. Not that PSTEC is a placebo but using PSTEC to create the same belief.
    Back to money worries. These also bring with them a raft of loss of self-esteem issues. “you can't afford to go out with friends any more” “Everyone else knowing you are unemployed” Being seen signing on in the Jobcentre” “Failing at job interviews” Positives can help you get past these to improve your self-esteem and confidence.
    Hi Oz
    I think you are right in that If DG won the lottery it would not solve the PTSD, it might in the short term but it would probably reappear sooner or later.

    #23007
    Avatardiamondgoddess!
    PSTEC User

    WOW!!!
    MANY thanks Peter, Andy, and oz!
    So much for me feeling “isolated”  ;) !
    I will digest all of this.

    I did have a windfall a year ago, and it did not heal the PTSD, but there is PTSD about being able to “get plenty” more.  (In fact, interestngly, the windfall actually made the PTSD worse, because it went against my “can't get enough” programming, and I worried if I would be able to “get plenty” as the $$$ dwindled.)
    The windfall also serves as more experience of “easily having plenty” which I can use to manifest more now.

    I've been doing some breathwork again every day, which also seems to be helping somewhat.

    Yes, Peter, maybe I've been too “on it,” that is a great point.  I can “sneak up on it” instead.  I could also go back and click again on what I fear happening as a consequence of having more money.

    And this is where it gets interesting to me–I have HAD the experience of both “making” a lot of money, and being “given” a lot of money.  So I've already done it, and had no real bad consequences!  (Except for the fact that my subconscious associated the getting $$$ “cut off” due to recession as related somehow to me “having plenty,”  like I'm not supposed to have anything and am safer not having anything.)  It's old stuff!
    It is obvious to me that these PTSD symptoms are totally about old, childhood stuff  (and even some birth trauma); since I've already proven to myself that I CAN “get plenty,” and easily!

    And oz, part of the PTSD tension is EXACTLY about fearing I CAN'T “get plenty,” and that “they'll just come and make me have less” if I do have more, and what will happen if I can't “get plenty”–how will I get what I want/need?  They are not separate issues for me  (Maybe only someone who was abused financially would understand this.)  You can have PTSD symptoms from being financially withheld from, cut off, denied, etc.  Tim mentions this somewhere in Andy's “PTSD Option 3” that I have.
    And this layer of PTSD symptoms came up when my pre-existing work was “abruptly cut off” due to the recession–this part of the PTSD is entirely about being cut off by others and feeling “I can't get enough”.  (It's a personal power issue.)  My dad would (unnecessarily!) withhold $$$ and abruptly cut off $$$ for things to control me.
    For example, I have PTSD stuff about men and relationships which somewhat overlaps with the $$$ stuff, but I'm not concerned about that right now.  lol  you can have PTSD about anything, whatever the subject of the trauma was.

    Andy–I will think on all of your suggestions  and answer more specifically after I have pondered them, thank you!  (You suggested some Bowen before to me so I'll look for that.)

    I think of my symptoms as an “Extreme Freeze Response”–holding tongue (not safe to speak my Truth, ask/get what I want/need), holding breath in fear, and holding the “flow” of money,etc.

    Anyway, I REALLY appreciate everyone's time and ideas!
    I'm going to mull this all over and answer everyone more specifically next time.  I'll keep all posted on my “Adventures in Healing PTSD”!  8)

    THANK YOU AND <3 TO YOU ALL!!!

    #23008
    AvatarPeter Bunyan
    PSTEC User

    Hi DG
    Seems we have given you plenty to think about and work on.
    You mention your Father controlling you through money, this would connect all the problems and issues you have, except it does not seem quite traumatic enough to be the cause of PTSD to us at this distance, although it could be as we do not know the full circumstances. I think this is why Andy was enquiring about any physical violence that occurred about that time. This need not be directly related to your Father/money except in time. Your subconscious does not work logically and can make connections that do not appear to be related when looked at some time down the line later. Further more just the threat of violence would possibly do the same thing. Even more just watching a powerful violent TV program or something  like say one of the “Rocky” films for a young girl could also possibly be enough.
    Is there any mileage in this line of enquiry?
    Peter

    #23009
    Avataroz
    PSTEC User

    It is obvious to me that these PTSD symptoms are totally about old, childhood stuff  (and even some birth trauma); since I've already proven to myself that I CAN “get plenty,” and easily!

    And oz, part of the PTSD tension is EXACTLY about fearing I CAN'T “get plenty,”

    So you fear you can't get plenty even though you've already proven to yourself that can get plenty? Is the PSTD totally about old childhood stuff or about “getting plenty” or both?

    And oz, part of the PTSD tension is EXACTLY about fearing I CAN'T “get plenty,” and that “they'll just come and make me have less” if I do have more, and what will happen if I can't “get plenty”–how will I get what I want/need?

    To deal with your issues you have to face up to the truth of them. However the subconcious knows that facing up to your issues is going to be painful, so it tries to protect you by hiding your issues from you. It will use whatever tactics it can to do this. The term “get plenty” is nebulous, it's meaningless, it means whatever you want it to mean. Your subconcious will manipulate this terminology and use it as a tool to hide the truth from you. So you need to present clear truth to the subconcious so that you can begin to deal with it.

    What does “plenty” really mean? You need to look at specifics and look at hard numbers. Make a list of all your income and assets/savings. What are the things that you want/need? Make a list of them and what they would cost. Why do you want them? Do you really need them? Make projections, if your income was decreased how exactly would you spend your money? Do the same for if your income increased. You can look at all these different items of income and expenditure and see how you feel about them. It will help lead you to the truth.

    On another note your signature makes lots of mention of diamonds, would you say you're materialistic? You say you want “plenty”. One positive statement for PP I've used was “I only need a little to be happy.” Would a belief in needing a little instead of plenty be helpful to you?

    #23010
    Avatardiamondgoddess!
    PSTEC User

    Thanks, Peter!

    Yes, more details–my parents devolved into extreme drunkenness over years.  My dad started to go downhill when I was 7, which interestingly is when I developed a severe stutter (healed now, but must be part of the remaining jaw/tongue tension).  The alcoholism was accompanied by an increasing amount of drunken yelling over the years by him, reaching it's worst in my pre-teen/teenage years.  He scared the crap out of me, A LOT!!!  (And yes, he'd yell about money and withhold it and cut it off suddenly and arbitrarily.)  He had to LOOK AT you to yell, too, he needed an audience. 

    My feeling is, I just “held on” for years with this tension, and it worked, as I am physically healthy and somehow stayed sane!  But it's not working so great for me now, it's in the way of more life for me.

    I'm happy to supply any other details and am VERY grateful for your time and expertise!
    DG!!!

    #23011
    AvatarPeter Bunyan
    PSTEC User

    Hi DG
    Thanks for details.
    This looks like it might be the cause of the problem.
    A really big question… can you recall these incidents without triggering any symptoms?
    If yes then recall some and CT the associated fear/s.
    If not then the more indirect approach will be required.
    Every time your symptoms are triggered it re-enforces that behaviour response pattern and so more likely to happen again. So we do not want that to happen.

    One of the responses to fear induced “fight or flight” is to freeze, if you have ever seen a startled cat you would have seen the wide eyes, the rigid arched back, the fur sticking out, before it disappeared  rapidly into hiding. People are not so very different.
    When your Father forced you look at him did he hold you under the chin and turn your face to his?

    Can you look back and feel sorry for your Father and forgive him?
    He was responding to social pressures and in order to build up his own self-esteem he over responded by “bullying” someone weaker than himself. (Fuelled by alcohol). Unfortunately this was you. Wife beating is a similar thing.
    Unfair as it may be in your circumstances, to forgive is part of the healing process.
    So if there is any anger towards him then this is another area to look at.

    Because your own self-esteem took such a knock with these incidents with your Dad your subconscious might have found ways to build it up again using money. Forgive me if I am wrong and please tell me if I am but… Diamonds are a big ticket social status item as well as a security boosting re-saleable portable asset. They symbolize wealth and power something that might be a real magnet to you given your history hence the emergence of your symptoms in times of financial restraint.
    Peter

    #23012
    AvatarPeter Bunyan
    PSTEC User

    Hi DG
    Maybe I should declare an interest at this point, I have been in the jewellery trade for the last 18 years or so (my wife and daughter are both jewellery designer-makers) and (with my marketeers hat on) have asked many women why they wear jewellery. I have never got a really helpful reply. Usually it is “I don't know”. In your case perhaps I see one where it does not exist.
    Like Oz I saw your forum sig and wondered. You can hide anonymously behind a sig or you can say something about yourself.  :)
    Peter

    #23013
    Avatardiamondgoddess!
    PSTEC User

    Hi!

    I think both Peter and oz are doing a LOT of projecting here!
    I am hardly going to apologize/defend/explain my very real accomplishments and the accompanying financial success I've had, or how I care to enjoy it.

    And this has been in spite of the large amount of PTSD I've had to contend with!

    I even act in Hollywood movies!  My resume, and diamond collection , are something I am very proud of.  I think you're trying to make something “neurotic” about investing in beauty that only gains in value.  (I have plenty of other reasons for the jewels, but don't feel safe mentioning that now.)

    The money and diamonds (when it's flowing!) are a natural EXTENSION of my good feelings about myself, not a way to patch a hole, but we can disagree about that.

    I am hardly going to “ratchet back” my desires to make anyone else comfortable.  I am asking for help in continuing to get my power back (again!) so I can get back to using all I have going for me to succeed, since as I mentioned, I've already experienced that.

    By the way, you guys are acting out my “stuff” for me, LOL!, acting like there's something “wrong” with my achievements and the material enjoyments that come along with that.

    Is the Forum only for people who've never experienced/enjoyed success and money?

    Oh, and my dad never “forced” me to look at him when he was drunk and yelling.  He just needed an audience, he needed to see someone in front of him to yell.

    Your other points are well-taken.  I get triggered by the memories.  Yes, I feel very angry.

    Thanks for the lively debate!!!  And for the chance again to “hold my own” with people.  :)
    DG!

    #23014
    Avataroz
    PSTEC User

    I think both Peter and oz are doing a LOT of projecting here!

    You're asking for help with your state of mind, seeing as we can't actually see inside your mind obviously we're gonna have to do a lot of projecting :)

    I am asking for help in continuing to get my power back (again!) so I can get back to using all I have going for me to succeed, since as I mentioned, I've already experienced that.

    If you got your power back and succeeded are you sure you'd be happy and content? Or would your PTSD get worse like it did when you succeeded with your windfall?

    By the way, you guys are acting out my “stuff” for me, LOL!, acting like there's something “wrong” with my achievements and the material enjoyments that come along with that.

    If your achievements and material enjoyments have a negative effect on your mental health then yeah there is something wrong with them. Or least something wrong with your perspectives on them.I'm not saying this is necessarily the case but this is what your posts allude to.

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